Power vs weight debate

Waternut

Waternut

Customizing addict
Location
Macon, GA
I know the discussion of weight vs power has been discussed before but usually the options being discussed are not equal comparisons. aka 760 engine vs a 60-70lb aftermarket hull is hardly a fair comparison. That's kinda like asking if a kart tank or a b pipe would give better results...
I'm looking to spend around $1500 and maybe up to $2000 if necessary.

Hulls:
I'd love to get the highroller stunt hull but at around $3200 plus shipping (maybe cheaper on ebay) I'm afraid that's a bit out of my price range right now. Plus selling my SN hull won't return much money, if any.

Snowsxr's top deck conversion is certainly within my price range at around $550 for the top deck plus shipping and maybe another $50-$100 in assembly parts. However, it seems like the conversion would only lighten my setup by 20...maybe 30lbs tops. That's a lot of work for 20-30lbs and I'd net nothing in return as I couldn't sell anything.

Engines:
I can't see a 760 (62t based cylinder) being a big enough improvement over my 701 to even deal with the hassle.

I've looked at the GP800 conversion quite a bit and I'm willing to drive 6-8 hours one way to pick up a complete running GP800 so I could probably snag one for $1500-$2000 but timing is an issue as I'd want to know it's in good shape prior to making a weekend trip. I'm sure the power would be excellent and I would be able to sell my current 701 engine and a bunch of stock parts off the GP800 which would return quite a bit of my initial investment.

I'm open to other suggestions as well... It's just getting cold and looking for fun projects so I don't sit around bored all day.
 
Matt_E

Matt_E

steals hub caps from cars
Site Supporter
Location
at peace
Waternut said:
I know the discussion of weight vs power has been discussed before but usually the options being discussed are not equal comparisons. aka 760 engine vs a 60-70lb aftermarket hull is hardly a fair comparison. That's kinda like asking if a kart tank or a b pipe would give better results...
I'm looking to spend around $1500 and maybe up to $2000 if necessary.

Hulls:
I'd love to get the highroller stunt hull but at around $3200 plus shipping (maybe cheaper on ebay) I'm afraid that's a bit out of my price range right now. Plus selling my SN hull won't return much money, if any.

Snowsxr's top deck conversion is certainly within my price range at around $550 for the top deck plus shipping and maybe another $50-$100 in assembly parts. However, it seems like the conversion would only lighten my setup by 20...maybe 30lbs tops. That's a lot of work for 20-30lbs and I'd net nothing in return as I couldn't sell anything.

Engines:
I can't see a 760 (62t based cylinder) being a big enough improvement over my 701 to even deal with the hassle.

I've looked at the GP800 conversion quite a bit and I'm willing to drive 6-8 hours one way to pick up a complete running GP800 so I could probably snag one for $1500-$2000 but timing is an issue as I'd want to know it's in good shape prior to making a weekend trip. I'm sure the power would be excellent and I would be able to sell my current 701 engine and a bunch of stock parts off the GP800 which would return quite a bit of my initial investment.

I'm open to other suggestions as well... It's just getting cold and looking for fun projects so I don't sit around bored all day.
Click to expand...

If you're going to spend several thousand thousand dollars on a hull, I'd make damn sure that it's a hull that has been tested, that has been proven to be reliable, and that will have after-sale support.
JMHO
 
Brenden

Brenden

Location
Altoona Pa
i experienced both situations this year in my skis...first i upgraded my 701 to a fully done up Xscream 701....and i thought this was a big big big improvement.

Yet when i stuffed it all into a 60lb EME Q8...it felt like i created my own 900cc arm ripper...losing weight really allows your motor to perform with better potential...making it feel a million times bigger

By all means Go with a hull...biggest and best thing i have done...save the dough till a full superjet conversion is available for the Q8
 
SuperJETT

SuperJETT

So long and thanks for all the fish
Location
none
Top deck conversions aren't just the deck and some supplies. You would need a hood, hood seal, new turf, etc etc. It adds up. If you're coming from a squarenose, then a pole/bracket probably needs to be added in also.

Now, my conversion was well worth it. I dropped ~32 lbs doing it which is a 10% drop from where I was at 298 ready to ride which is fairly light to begin with. 267 ready to run is really light and for my total cost of under $2000 you can't beat it, but it does take some labor.
 
MADMAT

MADMAT

Location
Ohio
30lbs under a Superjet weight is AWESOME!!! That is about where you want to end up unless you are flat water.
 
djkorn1

djkorn1

kidkornfilms
Site Supporter
Location
Cleveland Ohio
Weight is HUGE. My ski only has a pipe and flywheel and it tears ass now that I dropped 75 pounds!

My conclusion...an SXR motor has wayyyyyyyyyyy more power and low end than a 701 with equal mods.
 
Waternut

Waternut

Customizing addict
Location
Macon, GA
SuperJETT said:
Top deck conversions aren't just the deck and some supplies. You would need a hood, hood seal, new turf, etc etc. It adds up. If you're coming from a squarenose, then a pole/bracket probably needs to be added in also.

Now, my conversion was well worth it. I dropped ~32 lbs doing it which is a 10% drop from where I was at 298 ready to ride which is fairly light to begin with. 267 ready to run is really light and for my total cost of under $2000 you can't beat it, but it does take some labor.
Click to expand...

That's very true. I knew about the hood but completely forgot about pole, spring, mount, turf, underpadding, etc.

I've read through different parts of your build thread on various different occasions and it's very helpful. However, wasn't part of your 32 lbs a lighter battery or was the 32 lbs only the top deck conversion?
 
orangefinger

orangefinger

Location
Reno,NV
Weight

I am in the market for a light weight hull, and I can still recall Pete's video doing a BF with the trinity and 865SS Team scream....

I think getting a tested proofen aftermarket hull is the way to go and swap your components for now and then upgrade the engine/pump even more as you ride.

I am starting my winterproject by reducing weight....
-20 pounds NOT ON THE SKI...thats always worth some consideration :17:
 
LIVE2RIDE Powersports

LIVE2RIDE Powersports

Live & Die 2 Ride
Location
WorldWide
I know most dont like fx1's for freestyle but.. I'm at 270lbs with a fire ext, 140mm pump, and a gal of gas..

It is so flickable with the ported 710. I'm going bigger this winter and dropping weight on the ski. Tryn to get to 250 on the ski and drop 20 off my fat azzz. I cant afford much, so i have to make what i have work.
 
Speedfreak

Speedfreak

Location
So. IL
I know that this isn't even one of your options but what about selling your ski and adding the $2000 to it. Then you can buy a RN with a ported 701 or better and ride that for a few years and try to hone some skills. Then if you think you need more power or less weight jump on it then.

With the advances in the past 2 or 3 years there is no telling how light or what kind of power the skis will be making in another 2 years. Or heck if they will even resemble the standups of yester year
 
SuperJETT

SuperJETT

So long and thanks for all the fish
Location
none
Waternut said:
That's very true. I knew about the hood but completely forgot about pole, spring, mount, turf, underpadding, etc.

I've read through different parts of your build thread on various different occasions and it's very helpful. However, wasn't part of your 32 lbs a lighter battery or was the 32 lbs only the top deck conversion?
Click to expand...

When I did the conversion, I actually went to a heavier battery. Before it, I was using a 4 amp-hour but switched to a 9 during the conversion. I'm around 50-60 lbs lighter than normal and the battery is part of it, the hull, the waterbox, the hood, the pole.
 
Waternut

Waternut

Customizing addict
Location
Macon, GA
hardcore said:
I know most dont like fx1's for freestyle but.. I'm at 270lbs with a fire ext, 140mm pump, and a gal of gas..

It is so flickable with the ported 710. I'm going bigger this winter and dropping weight on the ski. Tryn to get to 250 on the ski and drop 20 off my fat azzz. I cant afford much, so i have to make what i have work.
Click to expand...


I have actually considered the FX-1 route but they are fairly difficult to find. Aren't those hulls around 90lbs stock? I think that would put me right in line with a top deck conversion with different handling. I know there are a lot of things to consider with an FX-1 swap like pipe clearance, pump conversion, etc. but then again there are a lot of considerations with a top deck as well.

If I can drop 20-30lbs with an FX-1 hull, I would certainly give it heavy consideration especially since I'd be able to sell the SJ components or the FX-1 depending on which I liked better. Whereas a top deck conversion, you destroy everything you no longer need.
 
OCD Solutions

OCD Solutions

Original, Clean and Dependable Solutions
Location
Rentz, GA
I think that 30lbs lighter is a big deal and a properly built 760 or even a 701 for that matter can be a huge improvement over stock and can be done fairly cheap if you gather the right parts and shop wisely. I paid $500 for my TLR ported 62T 760 cylinder (including brand new 85mm ProX pistons), $300 for my Riva ported cases, $100 for a good used crank and $50 for Taper bored 38mm carbs.

I was/am gathering parts towards a SS865 build and just put that on the backburner and decided to buy a new hull instead. I think that my ported 760 in a 30lb lighter ski will be way more bang for the buck than a big bore in my stock SJ hull. Then if I want more power I can always upgrade the motor at that time.

At this time it is my riding ability and not my engine that is holding me back so going to a better handling hull makes more sense. It is going to cost me about the same money for a new hull as it will to build the TS engine so however it plays out will be a win win situation.
 
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