Super Jet Pipes, pipes and more pipes...

Over the last few years I have toyed with three different pipes for my ski. It is nothing special, just your typical run of the mill RN build on a stock bore 701 with the works done to it. Exhaust porting, case porting etc etc. The pipes I have tried so far have been the modded 650sx pipe floating around with a few of my own changes, a Speedwerx race version dry pipe, and right now I am toying with a Coffman's Sizzler pipe. I have an option to borrow a Factory Pipe SX-R wet pipe but am just wondering if anyone has ever tried installing one into a RN. A buddy of mine is running one on his 62t/62t but in an EME hull with a small fuel tank. My thoughts are the stock RN fuel tank might not allow the chamber to fit. Any experience with this? I have read that the head pipes for the SX-R 800 have a slightly more inward twist of a few degrees by comparison to the SJ version but have never read that anywhere else to confirm, is this true or are they the identical pipe? I'm in experimental mode right now so testing that wet pipe might convince me to buy it if it were to work out, but I don't really want to go through several hours of pipe change out and re-plumbing to find out it won't work the hard way, so I am asking you guys.
 
I have never had a chance to run a b pipe on my ski due to the unusually high price for used pipes. But compared to other skis I have been on with them, my experience tells me the Speedwerx was by far a more potent pipe. The only issue I am having right now is keeping couplers on it. It's not a freestyle/freeride pipe and the added weight of the water jacket is too much for the hard landings in my opinion. My manifold spigot on the pipe is spider cracking from being thrashed around off of the hard landings. I think if it were more solid to the engine it would eliminate a lot of the little issues. But nonetheless, best performing pipe I've experienced yet.
 
An interesting point too on the comparison between the Sizzler and the Speedwerx...because I've only run my tach on those two...the Speedwerx so far has peaked out at 6960 RPM. I think I said 6990 in a different posting somewhere. 6960 is the correct number. The Sizzler so far has maxed out at 6740 RPM. I must say though the Sizzler is a fun little pipe. Noticeably down on power by comparison to the Speedwerx but still a really fun little pipe. The initial bottom end hit is actually impressive, it is really quite light and solid. It is locked onto the engine very well. I had a lot of fun playing on water last night but definitely miss the dry pipe power. If I can get my hands on a true b pipe for a reasonable price I will get it right now for the science of the testing. Here is my Coffman pipe currently setup. Good pipe but runs out of steam pretty quickly.
 

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Location
Ohio
The speedwerx pipe I had was a beast!!!! It turned huge R's and looked and sounded amazing. I would rather have it hanging on my wall right now that to have ever sold it.

It just wasn't right for my set up.

I forget who....but someone in here helped me figure out how to slot the mounts and make the couplers last...
 

Big Kahuna

Administrator
Location
Tuscaloosa, AL
Did you slot the mounting tabs on the pipe so when you go to bolt it to the lord mounts you are not having to bend the mounts over? If you have not done this do so. This will take the pressure off the coupler. Once I did this I did not have any more issues blowing couplers.
 
I'm with you Mat, there is no way I am letting the SW pipe go. I don't like going backwards in power output unless I have to. I'm used to the way it responds, the power of it and I love the sound. But I do like exploring the other options if need be.

Yes sir, yes sir BK, the top mounting plate has been slotted. Both mount locations have a slot going toward the carbs as well as one going toward the flywheel. The bottom mount however is not slotted and I do have to push it into place to fasten it. QuinC mentioned getting a hump coupler which I have done. I want to try that but I am concerned about the o-ringed spigot breaking. I need to get these spider cracks welded before I consider reinstalling the pipe. That's why I am running the Sizzler for now.
 
I would also really like to locate a genuine Speedwerx manifold for this thing. When I bought it, it came with a Riva manifold. That has been a royal pain to work with to say the least. I would much rather have the appropriate matching manifold then the Riva, plus I just don't like having an incomplete setup.
 
I was pricing out a new b pipe last night to get an idea of how much used should be. From Blowsion a new complete pipe is about 760 if I remember correctly. I just saw one the other day used up for over 900! :O I don't care how rare it could be, if it's used it is guaranteed to not be the only one out there...maybe at that time but certainly not of all time and in no way demands 20% more than a new with warranty pipe. It just makes a person shake their head in disbelief at these disillusioned prices.
 
Blowsion shows $775 for mod, add $30 for a limited. I think the issue is supply and demand. Since factory pipe is producing very few of these they have become very hard to get your hands on. We used to be able to buy directly from factory pipe for about $670 or so if I remember correctly.
 

samsmith87

Site Supporter
Location
Chicago
Blowsion shows $775 for mod, add $30 for a limited. I think the issue is supply and demand. Since factory pipe is producing very few of these they have become very hard to get your hands on. We used to be able to buy directly from factory pipe for about $670 or so if I remember correctly.

I bought a brand new from FP limited for $780 this year. You can still get them from FP.
 
Location
Ohio
Did you slot the mounting tabs on the pipe so when you go to bolt it to the lord mounts you are not having to bend the mounts over? If you have not done this do so. This will take the pressure off the coupler. Once I did this I did not have any more issues blowing couplers.

I think you are the one that told me!

I sold mine to some racer in Australia. He took 1st that year in whatever it was. (10 years ago or so...)

I asked if him if he ever sold it to call me first!
 

bored&stroked

Urban redneck
Location
AZ
I was pricing out a new b pipe last night to get an idea of how much used should be. From Blowsion a new complete pipe is about 760 if I remember correctly. I just saw one the other day used up for over 900! :O I don't care how rare it could be, if it's used it is guaranteed to not be the only one out there...maybe at that time but certainly not of all time and in no way demands 20% more than a new with warranty pipe. It just makes a person shake their head in disbelief at these disillusioned prices.
Its not disillusioned pricing when people are paying it. Everyone wants one, not enough are made and in circulation. FP hardly makes any so you have to wait until they make a batch. Nobody wants to spend $1500 on a simple pipe so the B pipe is the only real option, used or new.
 
Well, some people have more money than they know what to do with I suppose. I personally would never buy from anyone asking more than the price of a new pipe regardless of how many are in circulation or how infrequently they are produced. There are always other options and if rarity were a factor then my Speedwerx pipe should be worth 1200 easy given the positive reviews by pretty well everyone that owns or has owned one. But the point of the thread however is not on the politics over who sells what for how much and who is willing to buy it. This is for the r&d of pipes :) I'm with MADMAT on this one, I will not be selling my Speedwerx, in fact I plan to re-install it this weekend after doing some tweaking to the mounting hardware and replacing some parts. I by no means can compete with those willing to pay outrageous prices for used items so it appears I will for a very long time at least be running my SW. If ever I decide to change out again though I most likely will go back to my Coffman Sizzler, I am really having a lot of fun with this pipe, it flat out rocks. Anyone considering one of these little Sizzlers would be considering a very good pipe. I don't plan on ever letting this one go either hahaha :D

Today was my second run after doing a very tiny little drying out change and it was all it needed I think. I have now managed to get that little pipe to hit the rev limit just like the SW did. My run today showed a peak of 6960 RPM on the tach, before on the first run, in the surf I couldn't get it there, today it made it. I have to say, this pipe is awesome. It's not the same power as the dry pipe, but easily about 75% of it and the holeshot hit is nothing shy of impressive...very impressive. It makes its max power very very quickly and has caught me off guard almost every time I was cruising looking for the next wave, and then just hit it when I see what I like. My shoulders and hands are surprisingly sore from how potent the Sizzler's response is and for the first time ever trying to hang onto a ski has callused my hands. I do use gloves too, this pipe is a workout to say the least but in the best way. It responds so well one can't help but love it. I debated buying this pipe for a few years, and when I finally did after having it in the garage for 2 months I debated changing out to run it, I am really very happy I did and gained the experience. It will definitely be staying here.

Tomorrow I will be removing it though until my SW needs repairs again...if it does. This week I had the little spider cracks welded up on the spigot and modified the lord mount mounting plate I had to make for it at work (it never came with the mounting plate over the head when I bought it) to better suit the lord mounts. I have never had an issue with it before but I guess maybe I am getting comfy with getting to new heights...literally...and the extra impact force of landing is probably my issue. Also I am considering going to back to using a little thin sleeve I made for it when I first bought it. The sleeve slides over the o-rings and takes up the slack inside the manifold, plus it forces the pipe to stay aligned 100% to the manifold. I think this too might be a huge saving point in why until this year, I ran the pipe and never blew a coupler. Last year was a very limited year for me though between the downtime of having to install a new crank and only a week later having a rather serious muscle tear in my right calf. That pretty well signed me off from the season other than 3 rides between September 20th and November 1st. One thing I will try though just for anyone else thinking this...I will try to fit up into the round nose hull this SX-R 800 Factory wet pipe chamber and head pipe I am borrowing . I will leave the Coffman's manifold on and try to bolt up the Factory Pipe just see if it can be done. I searched for this answer for days before just finally saying forget it, I will find out myself lol. So for those of you with the same interest in this question, pics will be posted sometime tomorrow afternoon :)
 
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Oh, on a side note regarding the Sizzler...if anyone that has one and is interested to know how I have mine set up it is very straight forward other than two mods that should be done by a machine shop. When I bought my manifold two years ago or so, it was bored out to 47mm...sort of. It was Dremel bored and that means it was not consistent. Some areas were just a shade over 49mm so I took it to work and did the best I could to bore it to a clean and true 49mm bore. The head pipe on these are somewhere around 45-46mm stock...I had to bore out the head pipe to match as one would expect, also the gasket was milled to match too, but you can not bore the head pipe down too deeply at 49mm. In fact I would be hesitant to go beyond 1/4" deep at 47mm. For my setup, I set my endmill to only go down 1/4" and Dremeled the new shoulder into a ramp, if you bore the manifold too deeply you will cut into the water jacket. After the boring out work was done, I used JB Weld and filled in about 1/4" of the water jacket at the surface of the bored out side. Once cured, I filed off the most upstanding portions of the JB Weld, and then sanded the rest off using a portion of 220 grit sandpaper wrapped on a flat block of aluminum. Sand slowly. This way the surface stays flat, no bias to one side or the other, or rolled over corners. Once the JB Weld is flat the rest of the surface will quickly shine up. That is the hardest part of the mod work for this pipe. I have read that 47mm is plenty and I probably would have only gone that far with it but it was only due to the Dremel job of somebody else that forced me to go with 49mm. I have no idea how this diameter would compare to a 47mm diameter since I am the only one in my area with a Sizzler. It is possible that my diameter is too large and I am losing power since I have no basis for comparison. I just wanted to make that known if anyone decides to try this same type of mod work. If you are running a stock bore manifold and head pipe from Coffman's, don't be afraid to ask the guys around here with knowledge of these pipes, they are all good guys and genuinely want to help steer you in the right direction.

For water flow control, I used a 120 pilot jet and made my own restricted injector fitting for the stinger... very easy to do. The first thing you would do is take one of those little aluminum screw on caps for the NGK BR8ES spark plugs, a 3/8" brass 1/8NPT plumbing barb, and try to file off just enough of the plug cap diameter that you can make it into a minimal effort press-fit into the brass 3/8" barb. Now the pilot jets for Mikuni carbs have the same thread pitch as those little screw on caps for the spark plugs. So as long as you have not crushed the cap from pressing it into the barb fitting, you now have a water injector that you can calibrate to your liking by simply changing out the jet. Sure you could just shove a jet inline but I tried that once and the jet popped out and flipped sideways...it didn't work out so well...this will not back out. On the head pipe, for mine anyway as I have read there are a few different types of them out there...mine has only two ports. One for water in, one for water out. The water in is the one pointing up in the air closer to the front of the engine. I have noticed there are two different types of 3/8" water barbs. One has a thin wall and one is quite a bit thicker. This was where I made my very small change for today. I changed out the thin wall for the thick to reduce the volume of water coming in by that little bit and slow down the flow going into the exhaust stream in the head pipe. Then I ran a line from my pump (as I prefer to have one cooling line for the pipe and a separate one for the engine) to that fitting (the one on the front of the manifold pointing upward) and put a 90 degree elbow fitting in the second port pointing toward the carbs and aimed the 90 degree outlet toward the stinger. Instead of running straight into the stinger, I ran the maximum flow line directly to the overboard bypass with a T about 4" away from the injector fitting on the stinger. So if you are looking at the T, the max flow is the top of it, and the stinger injector is being supplied by the bottom leg of it...get it? This way the water flow is not under nearly as much pressure swamping out the waterbox but rather the bottom leg of the T just gets the minimal pressure as water will take the path of least resistance. I have had zero coupler issues so far running it this way. At the end of a ride my waterbox has almost no water in it when I run the ski on the trailer to clear out the waterbox. Without totally sealing the headpipe from injecting water into the exhaust stream, I think this is about as close as one can safely come to making these Sizzlers into a dry pipe and not scorch a head pipe coupler. As for temps, my exhaust runs very comfortably cool. I can put my hand on the head pipe after a run and it is just warm, you could probably hold your hand on it all day at that temp.
 

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