To scupper or not

[thegoldenboy]

I'm against scuppers unless its for a competition boat under timed runs.

I can wait the 1 minute of bilge time to pump out the boat after taking on water. If you only have a 2 minute run and need to throw tricks quickly, than the bilge will not be fast enough.

On a positive scupper story, if Rather B Sleddin didn't have one in his square we would have seen it go down 2 weeks ago to the bottom. .

He cracked his hull right under the bedplates and didn't realize it. 4" long by too much wide. Rode it around not taking on much water due to the water pressure being too quick.

Threw a trick and crashed, ski went away from him and started to sink upright, got back to the ski and got it started enough to pull away. There is no way a bilge would have kept up.

Than again we are only running single 500gph's.

So in this case a scupper saved the ski.

 

[Rather_B_SLEDDING]

^^^^ this is true.... BUT If I didn't have a huge hole in my ski it would never be a problem. I do like the scupper for gettin water out quick, but for the type of riding I do it's definatly not needed. I tsaves the 1 min of circles between jumps or whatever.

 

[D Slicker]

You're misunderstanding me.

I realize that the water isn't coming in through the scupper/one way. That should be obvious when the ski is upside down.
The water is coming in through a ********ty hoodseal and the pole breather hole.
The one-way valve, in turn, is letting all the (slightly) pressurized air in the bilge out, making the water ingress much quicker.

Without the one-way valve there, the ski would stay afloat much longer because there wouldn't be a 2-inch hole for the air to get out.

Well put, that is my point.

 

[suva]

My ski sunk once due to the one way this year, that was only due to me letting it sit at the dock for an extended period of time.
Every time I ride a ski with bilges only I have to get used to cruising around wasting gas while the water evacuates.
My ski doesn't sit upside down though.

 

[D Slicker]

Its rare that my ski get away from me but sometimes in the surf I cant get to it quick enough.

 

[Geeshow]

I also like a scupper for the water to get out will cleaning out and for the water to get out fast, but they do leak a hell of alot of water. So i put two 500s in also for security reasons. I would vote option two cause you can always plug it up like kahuna said,good luck.opcorn4:

 

[Prem1x]

My bilge blew a fuse and I didn't realize it at Galveston one year. If it wan't for the non-electrical one-way, I would have sunk that ski.

 

[n247hp]

i guess my plans for the scupper and no longer on the list for the winter build up and i am kind of happy

 

[Crab]

I use a single 1.5" one way and have had no problems exept when my X2 was running upside down for an eternity in the surf. It died finally with a small drink of seawater.

 

[demolition_x]

its too bad the ball check valve with a spring don't last. i remember reading some people having those like the home depot valves and what not.

but maybe a valve like that with a spring and a external scupper would not let any air out.

 

[Boris]

How about installing 2 one way valves inline ?
One could be mounted normally to let water out while riding and the other would be up side down for the times the ski does get away.

I love having a 2" pipe to let all the water out FAST.

 

[Matt_E]

How about installing 2 one way valves inline ?
One could be mounted normally to let water out while riding and the other would be up side down for the times the ski does get away.

What would that do?

The one way isn't letting all the air out because it's upside down.
It's letting the air out because the pressurized air inside the hull is getting pushed out the one-way, which opens with some pressure.
Two inline aren't going to fix that.

 

[SJ/XPBri]

Why not just have the flap on the scupper facing the other way, with some kind of tension (ie. spring, some "memory flexible material", or a magnetic catch)
Water would still be able to push it open, and if the boats upside down the flap wouldn't let air in.
Bri

 

[Boris]

OK, I guess I should try explaining a bit clearer.

2 one-way valves, the first one (starting from bulk head) would be upside down and have the direction arrow pointing into bilge.
The second one would be mounted as normal.

The first valve would just sit there doing nothing and its flapper would be just along for the ride.
The moment the ski goes turtle gravity pulls the flapper in valve one into the vertical position while the pressurised air in hull pushes the flapper against its seat and seals it.

Make sense ?

I'm sure a simulation could be set up to test this without harming any hulls.

 

[Matt_E]

Why not just have the flap on the scupper facing the other way, with some kind of tension (ie. spring, some "memory flexible material", or a magnetic catch)
Water would still be able to push it open, and if the boats upside down the flap wouldn't let air in.
Bri

You're not understanding the mechanics involved here.

Air is getting pushed out, not let in.

Think of it as an inverted steel bowl on the water. The bowl won't sink as long as the air pocket in it remains there.
Punch a hole in the top of the bowl, and it sinks like a rock.

Ski upside down -> the scupper tube is now one of the highest points on the ski.
Water pushes it's way in from the bottom, displaces air, which is getting pushed out the hull through the scupper.

 

[Matt_E]

OK, I guess I should try explaining a bit clearer.

2 one-way valves, the first one (starting from bulk head) would be upside down and have the direction arrow pointing into bilge.
The second one would be mounted as normal.

The first valve would just sit there doing nothing and its flapper would be just along for the ride.
The moment the ski goes turtle gravity pulls the flapper in valve one into the vertical position while the pressurised air in hull pushes the flapper against its seat and seals it.

Make sense ?

I'm sure a simulation could be set up to test this without harming any hulls.

I gotcha.
I don't think it would work for getting water out. As soon as you have water sloshing through the tube to get out, the inverted flapper would most likely close due to water pushing against it.

I like the ideas though....I hate the thought of having only electric bilges on board. That sucks, too.

 

[demolition_x]

here....


i get his idea, but idk if when the ski is upside down you would get a great seal. water closing a scupper is one thing air closing a scupper is another thing.

 

[SJ/XPBri]

Matt,
I phrased that last part wrong, if the scupper is held closed, and your air intakes reach the bottom of the hull, what would cause the water to come in? Just trying to brainstorm on here.
Bri

 

[Boris]

The angle of the pipe while the ski is upside down might be crucial.

I might pick up a couple tomorrow and play around.

 

[Flash-FX]

I am currently running on my FX, 2 3/4" duckbill valves on 3/4" sch 40 pvc pipe like joe b described. So far no major issues...but then I haven't done any "ghost riding" unmanned ,long duration, upside down surf rides. Basically, I use them for wash down. I'm tired of siphoning out (and getting mouthfuls) of bilge water. Pro-Freestyle guys might still need those big dump valves W/big pumps.